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| Home Made Boards (6188 Posts)
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Home Made Boards |
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west
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On 12/15/2004 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
west marine m,makes a wipe/brush on liquid that's supposed to treat aluminunm for bonding with epoxy, i bought some but havn't tried it yet. Anodizing is a treatment for coloring aluminum, supposedly you emmerse the aluminum part in hydrocroric acid(car battery stuff) and run a dc current through it this converts the surface to al ox ,it's a hard substance but its porous to take in any number of dyes,seems like glue would be welcome as well. Oxide formed in this matter has a different shape than your basic run of the mill ,formed by air type of aluminum oxide.
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Alu again
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On 12/15/2004 Duane
wrote in from
United States
(68.15.nnn.nnn)
I looked it up and did a little research. Some claim that the oxide on aluminum forms so fast that it re-apears before you can bond. I saw a reference to a clever technique: to take some catalyzed epoxy and thin with acetone. Soak some of this up with a Scotchbrite abrasive pad, and scour the aluminum. The result will be a scoured clean alumium surface with a very thin layer of epoxy, stabilized and sealed off from oxidation, as well as ready to bond on the carbon without contact
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Carbon and aluminum
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On 12/15/2004 Duane
wrote in from
United States
(68.15.nnn.nnn)
This should not be an issue. It can be trouble in environments where there can be galvanic potential such as in road environments with salt, etc. But as you say, a thin layer of epoxy will prevent the contact in the first place.
I would rough up the aluminum with a fine grit first, and use an acid prep to remove surface oxidation, right before bonding. the thin layer of oxide that quickly forms on aluminum will seriously degrade the bond, as it does with paint finish on aluminum as well.
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Alu and carbon
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On 12/15/2004
Svarteld
wrote in from
Sweden
(213.64.nnn.nnn)
Has anyone glued aluminium and carbon with epoxi? I've read that since carbon leads electricity, it can form a galvanic element with alu, if glued together with contact. So if oxide develops where they joint, there can be weakness or delamination over time.
I have a 3D-curved surface piece I need to do, and bending some alu would make it easy to develop the shape, and then maybe laminate it with carbon on both sides to make it strong enough - it needs to be thin but rigid. the curved surfaces will aid in stiffness, just like concave will on a deck. Maybe laying a first layer of epoxi on the alu will keep the materials out of contact. Guess I could also use the curved alu plate as a mold for an all-carbon laminate.
Any suggestions/experience?
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New homemade foamcore glass board
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On 12/12/2004
Greg Olsen
wrote in from
Canada
(206.172.nnn.nnn)
Hey guys,
This is my third board since I got back into this in September. It is a 1/2" Alcan foamboard with a claypaper coating (so no camber) wrappped with glass and Polyester resin. A bit too stiff for my 215lbs but cool looking I think.
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canada says thanks
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On 12/8/2004
tom in toronto
wrote in from
Canada
(64.228.nnn.nnn)
To all those who wrote in w v-lam advice, thankyou! You've saved me needless mistakes and frustration (and wasted money...this board-building stuff gets pricey!)I will investigate further...if there's a builder doing this commercially who can take an apprentice, my hand is up.
P.S. Svarteld...that's a nice board you got there. Keep it up.
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Selling
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On 12/8/2004
Svarteld
wrote in from
Sweden
(213.64.nnn.nnn)
SF,
Thanks - I'll think it over again when spring comes - it's only recently that I've managed to cut down on weight and thickness while maintaining deck stiffness, but I've yet to experiment with lighter cores, like balsa and hollow structures. Another idea of these shorter speedboards is to make them lighter than usual, to allow for damped trucks wich weighs more, and still pass the weight restrictions for competition. I'll just barely do so with big wheels and without lighter cores, so there's some more work before I can send something I'm pleased with. Also, the stable/slow geometry will need more steering range from the trucks, wich is why I'm doing bushing experiments - looking good so far, but there's more to try. Maybe It'll all be finished in spring, hopefully meaning a small, low, damped, stable-but-turny, easy-to-ride/brake thingy - until then I'll work on my snowboarding :-)
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selling decks
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On 12/8/2004
SF
wrote in from
United Kingdom
(82.68.nnn.nnn)
Hey Svarteld,
if you need anyone to test one of those boards of yours, then I'd be happy for you to send me one. Sheffield, England is riding well at the moment. your stuff looks fascinating - it's great to see a few new ideas, and I've been checking this page a lot more regularly recently to see the latest updates.
I'm sure there are plenty of others here who would be interested to see/ride your boards, and if you do end up selling them I'm sure Lushlongboards would be able to shift you some in the UK.
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Selling decks
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On 12/8/2004
Svarteld
wrote in from
Sweden
(213.64.nnn.nnn)
himotoma,
Thanks for asking :-) No plans on selling any, It's just to amuse myself (and hopefully to race my friends asses off this summer, but I think they plan the same). Also, the latest decks aren't tried at real speed yet (won't sell anything not working) - hoping they'll turn out like normal all-out speedboards, but short, low, air tuck friendly, and with a couple of easy ways of braking. This deck is short, 83 cm, WB 76 cm, but with much slower geometry than most. I'm also hoping the rear will grip more since it's not steering, and make a standing resonant wave between front and rear truck less likely (wobs). But until summer, who knows :-)
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Svarteld's boards
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On 12/7/2004
himotoma
wrote in from
United States
(206.72.nnn.nnn)
hey svarteld,
are the decks that you posted for sale, or are they just projects for yourself?
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that ply v lam
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On 12/7/2004 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
i was gonna mention my dislike for that system,i've tried a couple of times. when they did feel heavy,i lost a bit of enthusiasm, so they sat around for a while waiting to be cut,they seemed to delame and warp before i could cut them,i thought my glue might be getting old but my recent board came out perfect with the same gluem,i might have screwed up on the glue mix. I kind of doubt it though,i blame the wood. The wing board is running into some problems,i thought i'd try it with out the cross grooves,it was probabely a good idea but i thought i'd glue the beams then notch them for cross beams then close things up with the second skin. Well the grooves are not deep enough to easily assemble thingsm,so i gotta do the crossgrains and notch things together. Things gotta be kept straight while notching, so every thing lines up in the final. This is getting tougher, just gotta think tank it for a while.
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v-lam pics
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On 12/7/2004 MoBoe
wrote in from
United States
(67.94.nnn.nnn)
www.longboardsbyfatboy.com
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v-lam plywood
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On 12/7/2004 Duane
wrote in from
United States
(68.15.nnn.nnn)
I don't really care for the v-lam made with plywood. It ends up being a glue-lam more than a wood lam, heavy and not really ideally engineered for strength. It tends to be pretty splitty since the original glue used in the plywood is not chosen for absolute strength but rather ease of use in making huge sheets quickly. With huge surface area it doesn't matter, but when you cut it into thin strips the stress on one of the original ply-ply joints can be pretty high. I've seen more than one board of that type with cracks radiating out from the truck holes. And most plywood, even "high quality" still has some weaker areas / tight knots / pith wood etc that can make one joint weaker.
Yes, you might say, but if it is skinned it will be strong. True, but then why does your core resemble a brick and quite possibly sink in water ? Too heavy for skinned construction.
That's another thing, with a v-lam of any kind, make sure the truck holes are firmly in the center of a wood species that is not splitty (oak being particularly splitty), nor on a seam. A tightened bolt wields enormous powers, especially if countersunk, and if you don't countersink a v-lam you've spoiled its looks anyway.
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groovy board
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On 12/7/2004 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(205.188.nnn.nnn)
cut the grooves in the wing board, almost forgot to do the "crossgrain" grooves for the crossgrain beams. It's freaky cutting the grooves, i think to accurate grooves you gotta push down solidly, directly above the saw bladem,3/16 away from the 80 tooth carbide blade spinning with 3hp behind it.
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Grip Tape
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On 12/6/2004
msk
wrote in from
United States
(68.190.nnn.nnn)
The best tape I've tried is Madrid's Flypaper. Incredible grip, and will outlast your board. Madrid sells it in sheets and bulk rolls:
http://www.madridskateboards.com/pages/product-list.asp?id=9
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v lam
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On 12/6/2004 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(205.188.nnn.nnn)
If you have a piece of 3/4 maple,it's nice and smooth on top and bottomm,when you cut it into stips,you would make them 3/4x3/4 if you wanted the board to be 3/4 inch thick but you could cut them .700(a bit thinner) or .800 if you wanted to.You flip the pieces on their side and use the factory mill finnished surfaces as the glued surfaces. You can use any number of different pieces of wood,any thickness,if you don't change the setting of the fence on the table saw all the strips will be the same width,the width of the strip becomes the thickness of the board. Vertical laminates that look like 1/16 inch strips are probabely made by cutting up plywood,this gives you a combination of vertical grains,suppposedly the best compressive strength, this is supposed to make your surface sheets of fiberglass or carbon be most effective.
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one last thing
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On 12/6/2004 yan0
wrote in from
United States
(140.233.nnn.nnn)
a 3/4" vlammed maple board will be A: real heavy and b: strong enough to support hevy equipment, there will be absolutely no flex. I reccomend either planing the stock down to around 1/4-3/8 or ripping strips to the width you want, then take those strips and rip them to the thickness you want. Any way you do it you loose alot to sawdust.
yan0
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more vlamming
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On 12/6/2004
Yan0
wrote in from
United States
(140.233.nnn.nnn)
As to the vlamming, if you cut up your board's now at 1/16 you are loosing 2/3 of the material (at least) to sawdust (the blade is 1/8"). The Vlam I made didn't have camber or concave, just a flat plank. I also laid them up a bit different than herbN, but I like what he suggested.. I have a jig planned that is going to combine the two methods. Annnyways.. to get camber/concave in a vlammed board, you need to do another lamination. Some put some birch or a veneer on the top/bottom to hold the curves. Most others put fiberglass and or Carbon on. Bend the board how you want it and do the layup, or press it in a jig with a peice of birch with no-stick between the carbon and the jig so that it is like:
Jig-No Stick-Carbon/glass-(epoxy)-Vlammed core- the exact same thing backwards
Yan0
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v-lams
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On 12/6/2004
tom in toronto
wrote in from
Canada
(64.228.nnn.nnn)
thanks to yanO and herbN (call me tomT)
I'm confused still about how to cut and lay the strips. Do I just cut my 3/4" x 10" board of solid maple into a hundred 3/4" x 1/16" strips and then glue them back together? Do I reverse direction of every other strip? Do I carve the contours in or press them?
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Grip
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On 12/6/2004
Yan0
wrote in from
United States
(140.233.nnn.nnn)
Bender,
I don't know what the rest do, but I use Jessup, works really well, and has more grip than the stuff you find on most shortboards. As far as Vlams go, the best pics that I have found online is at www.hugh308.com , look for herbN's stuff. Also check out fiberflex and loaded.. nice stuff.just because I need to toot my own horn, I have one vlam up on my site www.geocities.com/runyan0/pages/projects.html
Yan0
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VLAM pictures
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On 12/6/2004
Bender
wrote in from
United States
(128.200.nnn.nnn)
PS I've been reading this part of the forum a lot lately....whos got pictures of theire Vlams somewhere on the WWW to look at. Interested in seeing everyones work.
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get GRIP TAPE somewhere
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On 12/6/2004
Bender
wrote in from
United States
(128.200.nnn.nnn)
Hey guys. I'm setting up a bunch of decks and want to know who's GRIP TAPE everyone is using. Im looking for a cheap source of bulk, or just stuff over 40-42" in single sheets inorder to cover the entire top of the decks. Thanks guys I appreciate it. In the event that I buy a ridiculous amount of bulk grip tape, I'll give who anyone who helped grip tape at cost.
Shred-4-life
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By the way
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On 12/5/2004 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(64.12.nnn.nnn)
i just started "the wing" ,radio hawk just ended, bam radio just started, i got serious radio today, i'll call it serious cause everything else is a joke now.
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v lams made easy
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On 12/5/2004 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(64.12.nnn.nnn)
the easiest way ,i've yet to imagine, to make vlams,is cut the strips(you need a consistant,straight cutting saw)then take a flat board add a layer of nonstick and bolt down one strip on the edge of it,lay down all the strips and screw down the one on the other end. NO real pressure needed,when you add glue titebond or epoxy(whatever you trust)between the strips,the strips will be pretty hard to fit back in,the thickness of the glue makes the pressure. You tap the strips down and make them even add a layer of nonstick,another layer of flat board and some heavy stuff. When things are dry, you sand it a bit,epoxy/ glass, then drill it ,cut it and finnish it off with whatever system is work'n well for you with the finnish birch ply. There you go ,"how to make vlams in 160 words".
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v-lam wannabe
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On 12/4/2004
tom in toronto
wrote in from
Canada
(64.228.nnn.nnn)
longboarder from canada lookin for a comprehensive how-to on v-lam technology including materials, methods, brand-names...any help greatly appreciated!!!
I'm gettin pretty good at the baltic birch ply boards...lookin and ridin real nice...but i'm gonna die if i don't ride a snappy flex-deck. Love the look of the dragonfly, fiberflex, motion, comet et al...since i'm handy i'll give the hi-tech deck a try if anyone out there can lend a hand!
sincerely wishin i was in cali!P.S. thankyou carver skateboards and old styar skates for the carver trucks...TRY EM YOU'LL LIKE EM
tom in toronto
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