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| Wheel Reviews (7945 Posts)
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Krypto's vs. SOH
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On 10/19/2000
Kaylee
wrote in from
(209.43.nnn.nnn)
The ad for the Racecore says something like, "Grippy when you need it, but controllably slid". One things for sure, the SOH blanks aren't wheels that can be normally slid, controllably or not. I'm sure someone out there can slide them, but I sure can't, and I can slide better on XT's. So if they are the same wheel, clear is by far grippier. go figure.
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Krypto & Clones
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On 10/19/2000
Hamm
wrote in from
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
Ben,
Not all urethane of the same Duro are created equal.
If you were to call Kryptonics and relay what you just heard, they would laugh and tell you thier 'formula' used in the Red Race Wheels is far superior. Besides Skate on Haight, there are many companies that use that EXACT same mold and hub, including Live Wire, Gravity FuManChu's, and World Industries.
Most people that have tried them will tell you that the Krypto's have more rebound and grip. I know my buddies Krypto's are a way better wheel than my FuManChu's even though the only visible difference is the color.
Dave
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Urethane
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On 10/19/2000 Adam
wrote in from
(63.192.nnn.nnn)
Ben,
My understanding of urethane development is this: Among the new "bouncy" urethanes that all modern longboard wheels are made of, producing a clear or translucent wheel is actually more of an engineering challenge than making an opaque formula. Chemical engineers are faced with all sorts of tradeoffs when they formulate urethanes, like durometer vs resiliancy vs wear vs appearance, etc. Usually when you increase one property, you end up lowering another. Producing the first clear wheel apparently took some doing, and clear wheels are noted for wearing out faster than opaque wheels. Conventional wisdom has held that opaque wheels are longer wearing. I believe that this is because the foundry can add more "stuff" to the urethane formula to strenghen it without worrying about making it look bad (i.e. opaque dyes cover a multitude of sins).
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Skates on Haight wheels are actually just clear 76 mm Race Core Kryptonics
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On 10/19/2000 Ben
wrote in from
(63.203.nnn.nnn)
I stopped into the Polk Street store for Skates on Haight the other day to see what's new. The gent with the lambchop sideburns behind the counter broke out some 76mm Kryptonics that they had just gotten in. He also brought out a set of the 70 mm Kryptonics and a set of Skates on Haight wheels, the 76mm clear with the chromed center. I asked him about the SOH wheel and he set it next to the red 76mm Kryptonic.
He said "it's the same wheel, just clear, with a chromed center. We buy them in lots of 300 from Kryptonic." I listened to that, talked about other wheels for a minute and then asked him again: "So they're identical except for the color? And you buy them from Kryptonic?" "Yeah, but we don't get them printed with the Skate Your Ass Off logo anymore."
Side by side it is totally obvious that they are the 76mm race core Kryptonics, the wheel otherwise known as "76mm 80A Classic with hub. Red only. Double radius profile. Offset bearing seat". Same shape and compound, with same "race core" just painted silver, and no added red pigment.
No durometer difference, urethane is the same, different only to the eye.
You can muddle over whether the red pigment prevents bubbles or simply hides them from view. Ponder whether the four scoops of pigment are performance additives or inert contaminants used only for marketing purposes.
Either way, if you want the 76mm race-core Kryptonic that dominated the podium positons at Barrett Junction in the Downhill, Streetluge and Buttboarding events, but you don't like red, get the same wheel in clear with a chromed core from Skates on Haight in San Francisco for about $2 less.
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Home urethane pour
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On 10/18/2000 Nick
wrote in from
(203.96.nnn.nnn)
Just how hard would it be to do a back garage urethane pour?
I mean you could make a mould/have one made off an existing wheel you like. I would imagine you need to inject the urethane formula. Has anyone tried this, or have any ideas?
There are internet sites offering home 2-part urethane casting kits.
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Red S9 dual durometer 9 balls
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On 10/18/2000
DOOBIE
wrote in from
(158.252.nnn.nnn)
I wore these wheels till they died, harsh slides because it was when I had these on my big stiffy I learned to do 360 powerslides... anyways, when they wore down to the harder inside layer(not the plastic core) they just dissolved the remaining sides started flapping so I stopped to check it out... we had the vid. camera out so I spun it and the sides came off with barley any effort... it looked cool on camera, but it wasn't cool when I realized that I needed put on a set of new wheels and wear them in... I got clear wheels, the same exact ones(I had made a large order for wheels and other gear from s9 prior 2 the incedent) the clear ones lasted a long time and still are usable and held up much better than the red so the color seems to matter, but I take what I can get as I can't get too picky livin in Kansas and having to mailorder everything... I gotta run over to the Taco Bell, today's my first day so I can't be late...
_________
DOOBIE
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color war also where are those bones?
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On 10/18/2000
john gilmour
wrote in from
(63.214.nnn.nnn)
Colors does indeed influence the performance of a wheel. My experience with darker colored wheels such as black has been that they were the fastest and can even show micro wear waves in the urethane. Lighter and translucent colors wear much better and have different grip characteristics.
The worst wearing wheels I ever used werr the inline wheels Kryptonics turbo core 78a durometer in metallic colors. They lasted just a week or two before they were down to the core. The first generation of coreless kryptos had a problem with chunking and teariing,, but the ride was oh so smooth that I still miss those formulations. Krytpo makes great stuff and everyone is entitled to a mistake or two. The fastest urethane i ever rode was used in POwell street bones in the early 80's they came in red and blue and were about 63mm and really wide.....almost55-60mmm wide! with a huge flexy lip. They were also teh grippiest wheels I ever rode. Unfortunately they were not fast in a slalom due to their huge deforming grippy lip, but they were an awesome cruising wheel. Does anyone know what happened to this mold and formulation? They had cores and are not to be confused with the Bones cubic. They had no double inner face and a straight inside edge with a rounded outer lip. Very deep cone as few truck keys could get in there.
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chunking
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On 10/16/2000
hugh r
wrote in from
(205.216.nnn.nnn)
While my personal observations are not very scientific...
I have experienced that riding surface is the number one influence on wheel chunking/splitting. Followed very closely by riding style.
I have found that the more road pebbles there are, the greater likelyhood of chunks flying of the thane. I have also found that the more linear/elevated cracks (like individual sections of sidewalk lifting) the more likely splits are to occur.
While I am sure that color additives do have some sort of effect, I think that the above mentioned conditions have more...
My two and a half cents... HR
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colors
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On 10/16/2000 Herbn
wrote in from
(216.107.nnn.nnn)
Dyes can change plastics in different ways,i know that in the uhmw that i used to make rails with, that bright florecent disgustingly bright green actually made the plastic hard and tuff.
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Urethane Clear
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On 10/16/2000 T n
wrote in from
(209.208.nnn.nnn)
Clear chunking as opposed to color. Urethane when its clear is just urethane. When it's colored, you have an additive that has no structural benefits. If color made things stronger than epoxy would come in fire engine red.
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colored wheels
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On 10/16/2000
Hamm
wrote in from
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
All this colored vs clear vs translucent wheel talk is very interesting. I, for one have tended to have opposite expieriences from what DT mentioned. The wheels that I've owned that have chunked real bad are solid color. Mainly white Kryptonics and black Super G's. My translucent Red Super G's have held up much, much better than the Black Super G's of the same durometer. And my white Kryptonics started chunking the 1st time I rode them. On the other hand, my clear and my translucent Power Paws have held up remarkably well under some very hard riding and sliding.
Anybody else having similar expieriences
Dave
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Blanks
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On 10/16/2000 rene
wrote in from
(216.101.nnn.nnn)
Nick, just so u understand printing of wheels is not a major cost the point is to build and market a brand name...if everyone road blanks then riders would not get sponsored and wheels companies or other skate stuff for that matter would not exist...
Also the graphics can make a wheel look cool and compliment your board so you have a kool Ride...
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wheel co's..
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On 10/16/2000
rene
wrote in from
(216.101.nnn.nnn)
Actually there are more than 3, lets start with Creative Urethane on the east coast, then the Biggy Bravo on the West (Hyper-Kryptonic) Elasco, Precision sports, Powell, Exkate, to name a couple more than just 3. also don't forget that Bravo has a factory in Italy, as well as Asia..
And also for the record power paw's are not made in any of these..
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Wheel companies
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On 10/15/2000 Nick
wrote in from
(203.96.nnn.nnn)
So just who are these three or so companies who make most of the wheels availible???
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colored wheels
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On 10/15/2000 Shaw
wrote in from
(61.153.nnn.nnn)
Solid color street wheels used to be dyed, white stock wheels were boiled in water together with dyes, the longer the process the deeper the color penetrated. This allowed companies to stock wheels and produce the correct colors when the consumer was ready. Mixed pigments are chemicals, different for each color, each pigment effects injected plastics in a different way, I am sure the same is true for urethanes. Black is usually carbon black, which is inert and used in car tires because of its wearing character. Black pigments tend to effect plastic compositions the least and tend to be the most predictable. Clear plastics can degrade due to ultraviolet exposure, urethane is one of those, pigments block out the exposure. One of the companies has a website with some urethane info http://www.creativeurethanes.com/about.htm
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Urethane
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On 10/15/2000
GBJ
wrote in from
(207.172.nnn.nnn)
As the former international distribution manager for the original East Coast Urethane (Nicotine, First Division and Chroma Wheels), I can verify things are basically as described by Herbn. The average skater wouldn't even recognize the names of the top urethane wheel production companies, if they came and knocked on their front door. In my personal awareness, (about 2 years removed) there are about two or three major producers of urethane wheels, and they do offer all the screening, marbling, custom color combinations, shapes and other options suggested by Herbn. What Herbn either doesn't know or didn't mention is the implied agreement between the name-brand skateboard equipment marketers and the OEM's (original equipment manufacturers), that the OEM's will stay low-profile and not upset the popular perception of the shape of the industry. This scenario is also true, but to a lesser extent in the modern board market. While there are more board companies that control their woodshops than there are wheel companies that control their urethane shops, most of todays skating youth would be really surprised to realize how many different board companies' boards all come from the same few woodshops.
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wheel companies
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On 10/12/2000 DT
wrote in from
(24.4.nnn.nnn)
Not always, but ususally you can't buy just one set. More like a case. and if you grew to dislike the wheel your stuck with a lot of wheels.
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super wheel co
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On 10/12/2000 Herbn
wrote in from
(216.107.nnn.nnn)
Most wheels are made by a few companies,who do everything,printing to. The companies that sell them as their own,are involved in the designing in varing degrees,depending on their size/budget. A personalized graphic can go on a totally stock wheel,or a custom color can be formulated,or the core can be cromed,or a custom mold can be designed.That cover just about everyone.
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wheel companies
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On 10/12/2000 Nick
wrote in from
(203.96.nnn.nnn)
Would I be correct in thinking most wheels are made by the same few companies, who then distrubute them to the skate companies to screen their own logos on and sell as their own??
I wonder if it would be possible to purchase an order of blank wheels and save on the screening costs, cause I hate paying for graphics and cosmetics and logos.
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Aluminators & Barret
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On 10/12/2000
DT
wrote in from
(24.4.nnn.nnn)
Power Paw told me that only their first run was defective (fingers crossed) and that they havent had any others reported since then, but if you bought one of those first sets - keep an eye on them after each run.
As far as Barret goes, i would check your wheels after every run no matter what your running.
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Easy riders
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On 10/10/2000 Herbn
wrote in from
(216.107.nnn.nnn)
Where are mine? i know they're around here somewhere.I thought they were good wheels,that affirms my belief in them. I just feel wimpy/lucky cause i havn't pulled the tires off my aluminators(yet).what!no Kwik splits?what a suprize:)how about carvers? didn't think so:)any rubber tires/wheels? It was interesting to hear about turns that slow you down to "contemplating pushing" speeds,Hardwicks sliding line ,hand down or just drifting alot?
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Aluminators at Barret
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On 10/10/2000 DT
wrote in from
(24.4.nnn.nnn)
You did what?!! Good thing you weren't fully bombing it, Barret is notorious for having the urethane pop off the aluminum hub!
I don't know why everyone thinks Turbos are really great as far as a grippy wheel, that large hub helps make them a fast wheel. The easyrider 70mm is a great wheel for both grip and speed. Leemo won the Gravity Games and Xgames on them, Hardwick won Barret on them, and if a non racer were to throw them on their carve board or cruiser they will also see that it is a superior carving wheel that is fast too!
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Aluminators at Barrett
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On 10/9/2000
roger
wrote in from
(198.206.nnn.nnn)
Keep in mind that the wheels that "real racers" use may not be the best choice of the rest of us for the same road. For example, on Barrett I first rode (carved down) using Turbos and quickly changed to a slower grippy wheel with very smooth slide to better match the very rough road and my level of experience (lack of it). Believe me, I was not looking for ride my fastest wheels on this road! I was looking for a wheel that had the smoothest easiest to control slide (for me that is Aluminator74), because on Barrett that is what you do, you slide!
I placed a distant last which may not represent Aluminators well.
On the other hand, a beginner had a lot of fun carving and didn't get hurt.
Roger
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Clear Thane copies
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On 10/9/2000 Pre-School Rider
wrote in from
(209.198.nnn.nnn)
I came across a set of clear(w/ a greenish tint) 76mm wheels that looked very much like my Livewires(itself a version of the 76mm Krypto),but with different core.Very soft,bouncy,sticky,looked pretty good,has some potential.What kept me from running these wheels on my 'bomber' deck was the little bubbles in the urethane.See,a few years back,I had bought some Classic-K's that had no markings,and were a cool clear color.I melted them second time out at around the mile-per-minute mark on old wooden luge.Those 'generic' Kryptos weren't like the old faithful blue ones from my younger days;they had air bubbles,came with crap for lathing on the back(Wobbled like mad),and promptly decomposed at speed.Those 76mm clear wheels will be used for 'Coleman Practice',not for any fast stuff.I don't know who makes these wheels,but it seems to me that they came from the same moulds that Hyper/Krypto use.This borders on being a Firestone like issue,where the lack of quality can mess with peoples well being. Anyhow,I won't be trusting wheels that feel wrong,not at any speed anyway.DT,did you sell me those clear Mundos just see if I was paying attention?They're lathed now,so they spin true,and I haven't gone past the mid forties on them(Standing),and they won't see any Luge use either. An aside note:Those 'White Kryptos' seen at the Gravity games looked an awful lot like Power Paws to me.
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Barrett Junction Wheels
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On 10/9/2000
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
(63.168.nnn.nnn)
Gary Hardwick (1st) was on Exkate Easy Riders, Darryl Freeman (2nd) Kryptos, Mark Golter (3rd) on Exkate Turbos and Chris Chaput (4th) Exkate Cherry Bombs. The rest of field was about split between the two. You have to understand that rider ability, helmets, leathers, nasty road conditions, availability of clean lines, bearings and dumb luck all played roles on this hill. If you were close after the second hairpin, aerodynamics and "roll" were key. Gary used an aggressive sliding line to get him through first, most every else braked and then rode it out standing up. I had Darryl Freeman in front me (close) and Mark Golter behind me (scrubbing hard) through that turn. Darryl was slow coming out but chose not to take pushes (yes, it is that slow after scrubbing speed) and I thought that 3 pushes for me would put me past him within the next 3/8 of a mile. I pushed once, twice, and right before my final push I got off balance and had to run off my board to avoid falling. Golter passed easily and the order never changed. I honestly believe that had I stayed on, Darryl and I could have worked together and reeled in Gary. Darryl almost did this on his own without an aero helmet.
The bottom line in racing is, you have to make a decision at the top. What does the course mostly demand, rolling speed, quickness, grip, sliding? Generally speaking, one wheel doesn't have it all. You pick what it has the most of. This was a long course and favored rolling speed for the standup guys who could get through 2 tight turns without losing it. I did a swan dive over the hay bales in practice, got back on, got up to speed and then hit Caterpillar tracks in the straights and slammed hard. The absence of grip in the wheels was partly responsible for the first wipeout, no wheel could have saved my ass in the second.
If you race or are serious about downhill, put every flavor 70 plus mm Kryptonic and Exkate that you can afford in the bag so that you've got options when you need them.
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