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| Skateboarding Law (490 Posts)
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Sucker Cones
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On 6/6/2004
Pat Chewning
wrote in from
(24.21.nnn.nnn)
Yes, probably a bad idea. Any good ideas to deal with a#@! drivers running over cones?
-- Pat
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Security
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On 6/6/2004
Adam
wrote in from
(66.121.nnn.nnn)
"Sucker cones" are a terrible idea.
By disabling the driver's car you are guaranteeing that the driver must stop and get out of his car to investigate. Once he sees how his tire(s) were ruined he will be mighty pissed off. Some people carry guns in their cars; most carry cell phones.
At best you'll cause a complaint and a cop coming to hassle you. The evidence will be obvious for him to see: A punctured tire, a booby-trapped cone, and a scofflaw skateboarder who so cleverly caused it. Since we're talking about affecting the safety of a moving vehicle the charge would likely be more serious than simple vandalism.
At worst you will get shot and perhaps killed by the driver.
In both cases you will be damaging the public perception of slalom.
Wise up.
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Security
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On 6/6/2004
Joshua Burt
wrote in from
(67.160.nnn.nnn)
Pat-I think the sucker cones are a GREAT idea!I have personally seen you being threatened with gun violence,and it will not be tolerated.Being a veteran and an avid martial arts student,I am in touch with several locals with similar backgrounds.Many of them work as private security,instructors,police officers,or 'bounty hunters',and have concealed weapons permits.The situation you described is just cause for citizen's arrest,and would easily be prosecuted in a court of law.Need some skate buddies?
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Protecting cones against cars
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On 6/6/2004
Pat Chewning
wrote in from
(24.21.nnn.nnn)
What do you thing about placing some "sucker" cones on the street? These would be cones that are set not for slalom, but in case some a#@! decides to run over the cones. These "sucker" cones would be placed over a circle of sheet metal with nails or spikes that would be covered up by the cone. When the car hits the cone, the nails or spikes would puncture the tire.
Good idea or bad?
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Welcome Wagon -- with a gun?
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On 6/6/2004
Pat Chewning
wrote in from
(24.21.nnn.nnn)
I found a really nice street to practice slalom on that is only about 3 miles from my house. It is a temporary location because it is destined eventually to become a major through-street that will divide a new neighborhood. The road is closed at both extreme ends, but open to cross-traffic about midway. I set up on the lower portion of the cross-traffic location to avoid going through an intersection -- especially one where the neighbors are not used to traffic yet and most of them just blow by the stop signs.
So the last time I was there, a car came down this closed street. The guy started to yell at me that "this is a private road" "We don't want skateboarders hassling us" etc. I ignored him and proceed to walk back up for another run, resetting a few cones I had knocked down.
So he takes his car and starts running over the cones. I see that he is headed right at me, so I move to the side. He swerves towards me. I run off the side of the road and aquire a big rock for protection. He stops right before me and "lurches" his car towards me. I raise the rock in defense, I'm ready to smash the windsheild.
He gets out, yells at me some more and says that he has a gun at home and "don't think I won't use it".
Then he leaves, running over a few more cones.
I've researched this road. It is not private. I had already written to the county and while they didn't give explicit permission to skateboard there, they did confirm that I am not prohibited from skateboarding there.
So I report this guy to the sheriff for destruction of property (cones), assault with a vehicle, and threatening me with a gun.
I plan to go back and skate there again (as soon as rain stops), but I will go armed with documentation of the status of the road, the sheriff on speed-dial, and a camera in case there is trouble.
I'll keep you posted.
-- Pat
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Washington State Law
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On 6/6/2004
Pat Chewning
wrote in from
(24.21.nnn.nnn)
The original poster (Ian) said that the reason they don't allow skateboarding is because they are afraid of being sued.
My response was just that they probably don't know that they are protected against being sued by Washington State Law 4.24.210
However, any land owner can prohibit skateboarding for other reasons, or no reason at all.
-- Pat
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Wa Law
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On 6/4/2004
Deano
wrote in from
(209.181.nnn.nnn)
Pat,
Use the "read on" theory when reading state laws. I do not have the exact RCW but there are specific places the state has outlawed skating (search the WA website for skateboards and you will find the exceptions) and the capital grounds is one of those places another is at EWU of all places.
The biggest problem I have had is being threatened with reckless endangerment. This has happened numerous times and I think the only reason I have not been arrested is due to my age, safty gear and treating the officer with respect. I told one cop that I thought what he did was reckless, he has to put on a bullet proof vest to support his family, but that it was his training and experience that made him feel safe.
He seemed to understand this and let me go....
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Washington State Law
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On 5/16/2004
Pat Chewning
wrote in from
(24.21.nnn.nnn)
Hey Ian,
It sounds like they don't even know their own laws. Washington, like Oregon and other states, have adopted "recreational use" laws that limit the liability of a landowner (including the government) if someone gets hurt while using the land for recreational purposes. This specifically includes skateboarding (under Washington law).
So if this is the ONLY reason they don't want you skateboarding, then you could point this out to them when you seek permission next time. (The law does not give you permission to skate, it only limits the liability of the landowner when you do skate -- with or without permission.)
NOTE: I am not a lawyer. This is not legal advice. Use at your own risk.
Here's the law:
REVISED CODE OF WASHINGTON
RCW 4.24.200
Liability of owners or others in possession of land and water areas for injuries to recreation users -- Purpose.
The purpose of RCW 4.24.200 and 4.24.210 is to encourage owners or others in lawful possession and control of land and water areas or channels to make them available to the public for recreational purposes by limiting their liability toward persons entering thereon and toward persons who may be injured or otherwise damaged by the acts or omissions of persons entering thereon.
[1969 ex.s. c 24 ‰ 1; 1967 c 216 ‰ 1.]
RCW 4.24.210
Liability of owners or others in possession of land and water areas for injuries to recreation users -- Limitation.
(1) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (3) of this section, any public or private landowners or others in lawful possession and control of any lands whether designated resource, rural, or urban, or water areas or channels and lands adjacent to such areas or channels, who allow members of the public to use them for the purposes of outdoor recreation, which term includes, but is not limited to, the cutting, gathering, and removing of firewood by private persons for their personal use without purchasing the firewood from the landowner, hunting, fishing, camping, picnicking, swimming, hiking, bicycling, skateboarding or other nonmotorized wheel-based activities, hanggliding, paragliding, the riding of horses or other animals, clam digging, pleasure driving of off-road vehicles, snowmobiles, and other vehicles, boating, nature study, winter or water sports, viewing or enjoying historical, archaeological, scenic, or scientific sites, without charging a fee of any kind therefor, shall not be liable for unintentional injuries to such users.
(2) Except as otherwise provided in subsection (3) of this section, any public or private landowner or others in lawful possession and control of any lands whether rural or urban, or water areas or channels and lands adjacent to such areas or channels, who offer or allow such land to be used for purposes of a fish or wildlife cooperative project, or allow access to such land for cleanup of litter or other solid waste, shall not be liable for unintentional injuries to any volunteer group or to any other users.
(3) Any public or private landowner, or others in lawful possession and control of the land, may charge an administrative fee of up to twenty-five dollars for the cutting, gathering, and removing of firewood from the land. óóóó Nothing in this section shall prevent the liability of such a landowner or others in lawful possession and control for injuries sustained to users by reason of a known dangerous artificial latent condition for which warning signs have not been conspicuously posted. Nothing in RCW 4.24.200 and 4.24.210 limits or expands in any way the doctrine of attractive nuisance. Usage by members of the public, volunteer groups, or other users is permissive and does not support any claim of adverse possession.
(4) For purposes of this section, a license or permit issued for state-wide use under authority of *chapter 43.51 RCW, **Title 75, or Title 77 RCW is not a fee.
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Use a Little Sense....
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On 5/12/2004 OldDude
wrote in from
(205.188.nnn.nnn)
People...
Use a little sense when it comes to boarding. The fellow who said "be glad you're not in Iraq" is right on the money. America is the best place to be; if you were in Iraq and chose to be rebellious, you'd be shot..or worse.
People really do have better things to do than hassle skateboarders. I've been skating since '75, and have seen 'boarding outlawed in many locations. Usually it was the result of somebody breaking or damaging something, or acting like a real jerk when questioned about what they were doing.
The cop who said he was trying to keep people from bringing lawsuits against the government is correct; it happens ALL THE TIME. People who do stupid things, then sue because of it. People are no longer accountable for their own actions; they'd just as soon blame their misfortunes on someone else, then sue'em for it!
I'm over 40 years old, and have experienced as many hassles as anybody else on this board. If you feel you've been slighted, direct your energy in a fashion that can help you resolve your issue. And do it calmly and sensibly. You'll never win arguing with a cop in a parking lot; but if you wear some decent clothes and go to the town council meeting, express yourself reasonably and in a non-confrontational manner, you might get something done. One voice can make a difference, just use it with a little good sense.
To the fellow who said he received points against his drivers license for boarding in a parking garage: dude, get an attorney, or at least contest the charge in court. Cops aren't lawyers; they screw up constantly, and their interpretation of the law is often wrong.
I am probably looked upon as an old man by many of you, but I've fought plenty of battles over the years, and figured out there's a better way to get your point across than flipping someone the bird, spraypainting a wall, or running when the cops threaten to ticket you. Take responsibility for what you do, and handle the situation in a fashion that makes a difference; not one that makes it more difficult for those skaters who will follow you.
OldDude
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Department of Natural Resources
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On 5/10/2004
Ian
wrote in from
(24.18.nnn.nnn)
If you ever are in Olympia WA, go to the capitol builing and walk across Capitol way to a massive State parking garage under the department of natural resources building. Its one of the best downhill maze ever. The parking lots are built down into the ground in the form of switchbacks, with about 300 ft between each turn. There are 5 levels, and the place is huge. But... the state patrol has 24 hour patrols of the campus and the garages are part of their tour. I recieved a citation at 4 in the morning, A MOVING VIOLATION THAT WILL GO AGAINST MY DRIVERS LICENSE, 100 dollars, and I am 86'd off the Capitol Campus for a year. Thats means I am denied my right to participate in the administration of my State. The thing that pisses me off is that it was a state building, we were bombing the hill(Not grinding, marking, no damage), and the cop stated that the main reason for the illigality of our offense was the State's fear of Law suits. Since when can government make laws to protect itself against law suits from the citizens? Since when has it been American to place a non-tangible entity with the ability to defend itself into the role of authority. Does anybody else see a major problem? But the point was longboarding.
I think this is the 5th time I have been hassled by the cops. All other times I told them i was ignorant of any such laws, and they let me off with a slap on the wrist. So I f you run it and get caught, tell them you had no idea. Other than that, its a killer ride.
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freedom
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On 5/10/2004 dino
wrote in from
(64.75.nnn.nnn)
I think we all have a right to persue happiness yes?? Well if it makes some dude happy to skate against athority so be it. He has as much right to rebel as anyone else has to conform.
Sometimes a little rebellion changes things for the better eh?
"Be glad you're not in Iraq"?
I really think it sucks when someone says crap like this... it's pointless. Is it gonna make that dude change his mind? Is he gonna wake up in the morning and go "oh joy I'm a free little skateboarder and I'm not in Iraq so I guess I feel better now that the fascist cop wants to supress my happiness." Hell no... it's just some lame attempt to keep everything in the status quo.
Shudup & Skate
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Spinning your wheels.
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On 5/8/2004 Mick
wrote in from
(198.81.nnn.nnn)
Anytime I can get on my board and skate, whether or not its in a pool or a park, or on the side walk it make me happy. I forget all the crap in my life. So if certain laws are made, restricting boarding, if I wear a helmet or can't skate in a certain area, I am not going to cry about. Or make broad stupid statements about "cops". I have found out if treat the dude with some respect, and just talk to the guy like a person maybe you will get some respect back. Maybe. Just don't act like a punk@$$. You make it hard for other skaters. A local elementary school here where I live let us skate only because when they approach we talk to them instead of acting like jerks. So be glad your not in Iraq, and stop whining about cops. Just slapping it down.
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Condom?
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On 5/6/2004 Observer
wrote in from
(207.69.nnn.nnn)
You guys are what make skaters(real skaters,not PUNKS) have a bad name! Either you are in your teens and have no responsibility or respect for others, or you are just the inner city scum that you portray ! Laws are laws..If you choose to break them ,then be ready to pay the price! I'm tired of low life graffitti writing idiots ruining a good thing!
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Laws shmaws
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On 5/6/2004 Wyatt
wrote in from
(65.110.nnn.nnn)
yeah!
what he said
I don't like to have to wear a condom or a helmet on my bike, now I have to wear one on my skateboard.
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sakte laws...bulls#@!..
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On 4/20/2004 travis
wrote in from
(4.12.nnn.nnn)
dude...being a skater..i dont lyk getting hurt but still no law should say tht you have to where pads..if you get hurt you get hurt O WELL!!but thts my judgement..
I SAY f#@! THE LAW I SKATE WHERE I WANT!!!
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Pro Se Litigant
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On 4/16/2004 Utahcarver
wrote in from
(64.12.nnn.nnn)
I'm new to this forum but, I've lurked for years on the other forums here. Over the years, I've been able to defend myself in local city courts over minor traffic infractions/violations. This is called Pro Se (you are representing yourself) in legalese. In all cases where I Appeared as The Accused, the charges were dropped. Why? Because cities/towns are Corporations first. Corporation's job one is to make money. The one of the reasons why you are being harassed by cops is they write citations to make their boss (the Corporation) money from a victimless crime.
I had to do a lot of footwork and study in the local legal library. Appearing Pro Se is not for the faint-hearted or the mealy-mouthed. The worst arguement to use (for traffic tickets) is that the court has no jurisdiction over you. The very best arguement I ever used was dealing with Procedure. See, state governments set the rules for 'legal procedure' in the court systems of the respective state you are in. If the courts don't follow the procedures (which they NEVER DO) that's referred to as an error. For instance, you cannot be prosecuted in most courts by an Information. The ticket the cop writes you is an Information, not a Summons. Therefore, I petitioned the court for a Proper Summons and a Formal Information. Because I never received a Proper Summons from the court, according to their own rules, they cannot procede with a case. If, for some reason, you happen to get a Proper Summons and Formal Information, most court rules state that it has to be on an 8.5" x 11.0" sheet of white paper, double-spaced, 1-inch margins, etc, etc, see where I'm going with this? Yep, technicalities. We all complain about'em when some guilty party walks free but, that's the facts: The court has to obey the rules of the game. Your job, make'm obey the rules of their own game.
I never ever got one court to adhere to the rules of procedure. They, the court, knows that if you are convicted and an appeal overturns the verdict, the court can be sued for Judicial and Prosecutorial misconduct. I know of one township in northern Utah that was bankrupted TWICE by the same guy because the court was found guilty of misconduct on appeal. One of the first things cops are taught in the academy is Civil Liability. If a cop violates your civil rights, which may include skateboarding on your local hills, and you get convicted by his improper Information and no Summons, you can potentially bankrupt him and the city he represents by filing a civil suit against them. So, in all the traffic citations I got and went the Pro Se route of defense, the courts backed off and let me go. There's more fish in the pond and they didn't want to tangle with someone who might cost them money.
Warning: This little bit of knowledge I'm sharing with you is not absolute. Please use care. This is just a taste of what you can do. It doesn't include information or skill at being good or better than the courts, or their officers, the cops. If you are in a small town, be very careful of Pro Se procedure.
I've never applied this to skateboarding but, I can only imagine that if the courts couldn't get it right with a bad taillight, they probably won't get it right with four little wheels and a wooden board.
Also, make sure you are in front of a REAL judge. Most cities don't want to pay for the real ones, which by law they have to, rather they hire judicial assistants. JA's are not bonded by the states. Therefore, they are breaking the law if they prosecute you.
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I live in..
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On 4/16/2004 Jared
wrote in from
(69.165.nnn.nnn)
I live in this s#@!y little town named Granville. It wasn't so s#@!y when I was able to board but now it is. I can still board in the township but then I don't have access to water, food, and all the good s#@! in town. I f#@!ing hate the cops in my town. They are complete a#@!s. I'm most definitley still going to skate and get served tickets/citations. Sounds like morning runs would be pretty ideal and a low chance of cops doing jack s#@!. Hmm...maybe early this sunday. Yeh that sounds good..oh..wait..church in my town in like a god damn festival so I guess not. Hmm..it doesn't matter. I'm going to skate sunday all day! My main issue with cops and there laws against skaters is that how are our skateboards different from bikes and rollerblades? GG thanks.
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I fought the law...
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On 4/15/2004 Sketchmaster
wrote in from
(4.22.nnn.nnn)
CBO: Whenever a police officer tries to prohibit your desired activities demand that he cite the law regarding your alleged infraction. Take the cite down to the law library and look it up. Very commonly police rattle off lame abstractions that sound good at first blush but that won't hold up in a court of law.
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I fought the law and it won
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On 4/13/2004 CBO
wrote in from
(68.170.nnn.nnn)
Got my first stern talking to by a cop today. Coming down mt crested butte and a cop went by, fliped a bitch and gave me a talking to. Told me it was against state law. I said I will always longboard, and he said "not in my town". What kind of stupid law is that? I think we all should fight this bullcrap. Looks like its early morning runs for me now...
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cops
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On 4/12/2004
Reeve McNall
wrote in from
(24.126.nnn.nnn)
het JARED, where the **** do live, because in l.a cops dont giva ****PLUS just avoid the cops
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-My town's police suck-
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On 4/11/2004 Jared
wrote in from
(162.40.nnn.nnn)
Ok so..My friends and I are just gettin' ready to bomb this hill when a cop rolls up. Also, the cops in my town just suck and we have been warned before that we shouldn't be skateboarding in the road and they say its illegal blah blah blah. Anyway, the cop rolls up and says ok I've warned yeh once next time I catch you were gonna ticket you or serve you citations. Whatever I don't give a flying ****. I'm just wondering is it illegal to skateboard in the road like he said it was? He said it was something of a public saftey issue. For example if we were to die the would be held responsable. Is this true or should I keep skating?
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Selling custom boards
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On 4/6/2004
Roboto PDX
wrote in from
(63.242.nnn.nnn)
How risky is it to sell Custom longboards? Do skateboard Mfgs have tons of insurance? If I put a big DANGER sign on the board am I convered?
Thanks!
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License? We don't need no stinkin' License!
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On 4/6/2004
Pat Chewning
wrote in from
(15.252.nnn.nnn)
I've never heard of any city licensing skateboarding or skateboards. Sounds like an ugly rumor to me. Even bicycles don't need licenses ...
Gives new meaning to the term "outlaw race".
-- Pat
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Licensing
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On 4/6/2004 Sketchmaster
wrote in from
(4.22.nnn.nnn)
Does anyone have any info regarding municipalities attempting to license skateboarding? Is this a hoax?
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Thinking
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On 3/31/2004 Sketchmaster
wrote in from
(4.22.nnn.nnn)
Monghooste: The last thing I want to do is think like a bicycle fruit. What the hell is a blighty?
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