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| Speedboarding (19049 Posts)
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Speedboarding |
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Red Bull: Seattle
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On 9/12/2000
Danny Connor
wrote in from
(205.188.nnn.nnn)
Hey Guys,
Can anybody(chris)tell me what wheels VanBommel and Lehr were using in Seattle? I saw the pic on Chris' site. They look like the 90mm labeadas, am I right? Has anyone tried these wheels for speedboarding? How'd you like them compared to Cherrys? I am gonna get a set for my luge, but I might just slap 'em on my speedboard for the halibut. Thanks guys. And I can't wait until Barrett!!
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Foot Braking
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On 9/12/2000 Lono
wrote in from
(205.179.nnn.nnn)
Thanks Guys! And my groin thanks you.
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Braking disclaimer
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On 9/12/2000 GBJ
wrote in from
(205.177.nnn.nnn)
Y'know, I may have just talked some $*#$^*! there. I made it sound like I can mongo footbrake on any occasion, and that's not entirely true. I can do it, at will, on a board that has a tendancy toward being stable. My favorite slalom deck, like a great fighter airplane, is almost inherently unstable. Footbraking from this board requires a great deal of additional concentration.
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Foot braking
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On 9/12/2000
GBJ
wrote in from
(205.177.nnn.nnn)
Rogerj- That is precisely how I do it. Right down to the sensation of slightly more weight in the heel of your drag-foot. It seems that Chris, you and I are all mongo-brakers. There are other people who think mongo breaking is insane. Chris describes just how deliberate he feels he needs to be, and perhaps that's because he's going so much faster than any speed from which I've ever had to brake. To me, at more mundane speeds, the process and the weight-transfer curve are completely second nature, so I can "engage" the brake as fast, as slow, as completely or as partially as any situation might dictate. Chris mentions that those comfortable with dropping their back leg are more effective in using the method racing and going into turns. I think he's probably right, but being a mongo pusher/braker I think they're insane. I've never really wanted to expose my groin muscle to that particular danger.
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foot braking
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On 9/12/2000
rogerj
wrote in from
(32.100.nnn.nnn)
Thanks GBJ, I just started practicing foot dragging/braking with some speed (about 25mph I guess) and could use a review. My board foot is slightly forward of center (mongo pusher here), dragging foot just behind it by a few inches - flat with a little more pressure on heel than to toe. Both feet pointed forward, drag leg slightly bent (board leg obviously bent more), standing up straight with arms out to the sides for balance. Does this sound about right? Curious, is "mongo braking" a disadvantage?
thanks!
rogerj
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WhoIs, Manu, Braking
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On 9/12/2000
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
(63.168.nnn.nnn)
Mike G, That is Todd Lehr, ranked #2 and #5 in the Downhiller of the Year and EDI/Gravity Games standings. Very few riders (including myself) can understand how he pushes off, obtains that tuck, attacks corners and then brakes from that position. He is incredible and can be hard to draft without "sinking to his level" ;) He is also the #7 ranked EDI/Gravity Games streetluger with a great future in extreme sports.
Manu, A race is just not the same without you. I respect you and your responsibility to family, I know we will meet again soon. Biker went out in the first round of the 4 man because he didn't do his homework. I walked the course 3 times the day before and noted the rough spots on the inside line out of turn 2. Biker saw them for the first time on that run and handled it well, but was draft bait for me and then John Rogers. It rained on only one heat that day and it just happened to be during Biker's 2 man run. They both went down hard in the first turn. It happens to the best of us.
Lono, GBJ did a great job of explaining some braking techniques, there are many. Many riders look at other guys methods of braking and think that they are nuts. I standup quickly, airbrake for as long as I can, carefully position my back foot straight, remove my front foot and then drop it behind and to the side of my back wheels. If I were just starting out and didn't have a preference, I would learn to stand (or crouch) on my front foot and drop my back foot to the side because you can do this before/during turns and brake later and faster than those who can only airbrake well in advance. I've even seen guys who crouch, foot brake, sit down on the board and then luge brake with both feet. I got bowled over by a bad brake job in Seattle. This is not the easiest thing to master. Does anyone here smell a video clip in the near future? My bad toe will give me a good reason to learn to brake with my right foot, and to practice pushing off that way too. I may have start with my opposite push foot in DC. All that cross country switch pushing in my youth could pay off now. BTW, I don't know when you last checked, but there are more pictures of the Red Bull race at ChrisChaput.com on the "Red Bull Seattle" link. The Sta-Puff Marshmellow man lurching through the 2nd turn. God that was fun.
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Foot Braking
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On 9/11/2000
GBJ
wrote in from
(205.177.nnn.nnn)
When foot braking, different people have different preferences on which foot they drop, but I think most often it is whichever foot you use to push. So, to learn, take the foot off the board and keeping it absolutely flat and planing on the surface, gradually transfer a little weight to it. Obviously, your foot is going to want to pull behind you, so GRADUALLY play with it. Learning with a little speed is actually helpful. Get comfortable with the adjustments you have to make with your weight to brace against the drag of slowing this way. Once you get comfortable with it, you can do it fast or slow, and frankly, for me the experience is alot like disengaging a clutch, in gear, in a car or on a motorcyle. It's a matter of keeping all the different forces balanced.
I used to have a great video clip of the Wide World of Sports coverage of the Catalina Classic in the late 1970's. In the final run of the Men's Slalom, it was John Hutson against Bobby Piercy, which some of us will recall is a match for the ages. They both blaze this long, rhythmic hill course. Piercy edges Hutson, and within twenty feet after crossing the finish line PIercy has dropped his left foot (mongo) and brought himself to a screeching, sneaker-smoking halt. Best example of the art I've ever seen. If anyone has the Catalina Classic coverage (ESPN Classics has shown it), I'd love to get a copy. Mine got eaten.
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Brakes
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On 9/11/2000 Lono
wrote in from
(205.179.nnn.nnn)
Chris- please tell us about foot dragging to slow down, or stop.
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red bull
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On 9/11/2000 Mike G
wrote in from
(64.7.nnn.nnn)
Hey Chris,
Who is that on your picture site of the red bull seatle race that has his feet together like you do when you stand? Its an odd stance. Is it stable at high speeds? Just curious.
-Mike
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red bull race
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On 9/11/2000 Manu
wrote in from
(193.250.nnn.nnn)
i would like to congratulate all the riders and especially all my good friends who won and made good results.
But where is Biker ? Is that the end of a myth ?
Cheers,
MANU.
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congratulations
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On 9/11/2000
Manu
wrote in from
(193.250.nnn.nnn)
i would like to congratulate all the riders and especially all my good friends who won and made good results.
But where is Biker ? Is that the end of a myth ?
Cheers,
MANU.
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Bobble
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On 9/11/2000 Herbn
wrote in from
(216.107.nnn.nnn)
I'm somewhat familiar with this.I remember distintly doing a one time driveup /skatedown, as opposed to walking up,i pretty much bombed over a crack or a chiseled groove(like when they're about to work on a water pipe)it seemed insignificant enough in the car(duh!!)but when i went over on my Randal"see how loose i can run them and not wobble"1's, the swerve was unbeleivable,had i been on anything but Powerpaws,traction and 74a shock absorbtion,i sure it would have been one for the crash page.
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Wobble or Bobble
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On 9/11/2000
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
(63.168.nnn.nnn)
Bob, I'm glad you asked. It is not the beginning of a speed wobble but it looks it from where I stopped the clip. It is one of two things and I can't honstly say which, because they would tend to look identical. It is either what I call a "Bobble" (not named after you Bob ;) which is a momentary reaction to hitting some irregularity in the road, or it is me practicing a quick twitching maneuver that I use to initiate a pass at the last second. I used this dart to the inside technique earlier in the clip, right before the slingshot. Sometimes we also practice a cat and mouse game. As soon I passed Mark, he would jump right back behind me by moving to his left, and I, anticipating this move would dart over to the right and leave him without a draft. The lead rider has to balance out the effectiveness of his elusive line, and the speed he is scrubbing by doing so, along with the amount of real estate before the bottom. This stuff is very, very fun when riders are closely matched.
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Red Bull Pics
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On 9/11/2000
Bob
wrote in from
(192.73.nnn.nnn)
Chris,
I checked out the drafting and passing clip on your site. Pretty cool.
As the very end (when you appear to pull into the lead), it looks like you got a small wobble?
Just curious. By the way -- how fast are you going in that clip?
Bob
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Red Bull Pics
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On 9/10/2000
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
(63.168.nnn.nnn)
It'll be fun Hugh. I've put a couple of pictures out at http://www.ChrisChaput.com/seattle or just go to my homepage and select Red Bull Seattle. That one race picture was on the front page of the Seattle Times local section. I can't wait to see more pictures!
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still a little yellow bull
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On 9/10/2000
hugh r
wrote in from
(205.216.nnn.nnn)
Chris,
Thanks for the vote of confidence, but... I am not quite ready to compete with you "real" racers yet. I fight with my nerve... But I am ready to charge the dump hill against you (the first half... I don't have the ability to drag my foot at 40 like you and Mark were doing!) HR
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Hugh R So Beautiful
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On 9/10/2000
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
(63.168.nnn.nnn)
Hugh, Great job on the Low CG board. I totally agree that you shouldn't cut out any more material than you really have to. I set mine up so that in the tightest turns with the loosest trucks, I would have 1/4" or less clearance with an 82mm or larger wheel. I also think that my board is wider so an inch on your board made for a more severe cutout angle. I also try and make sure that the hanger doesn't contact the deck in a turn. I like the plate on the bottom but think that grinding off the baseplate gussets (tabs) makes life (and templates) a lot easier.
Looks like you're about ready to do some serious downhilling. Would it be premature of me to call Red Bull and let them know that you're coming?
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cut down low rider
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On 9/10/2000
hugh r
wrote in from
(205.216.nnn.nnn)
I just finished the cut down/drop thru s9 pintail... It turned out pretty good, but I should have knocked a couple of inches off of the wheelbase (next time for sure) because it is a little too flexy for my weight. So if one of you has a deck you want to donate... let me know!
I used the dimesions for the wheel cut outs off of Chris C's page (and gave proper web credit too)
So, for a first experiment it worked out well... version 2 will be better. I posted the whole adventure on my site... HR
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Gentlemen Start Your Engines........
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On 9/10/2000 WinstonT.Grant
wrote in from
(209.240.nnn.nnn)
"Welcome to Starbucks,may I take your order PLEASE?."I don't know about anyone else,.but..I SMELL COFFEE!!!Congratulations to EVERYONE who had the balls (and brains)to run ANYWAY under dicey conditions in Seattle,Congratulations to Van Bommel and Lehr,and to everyone else who managed to get through it okay...Now comes the history lesson..That Ghostly Figure in your rearview mirror,coming up FAST behind you? With a hot cup of coffee in each hand? IT"S...our future.This is why after scoffing at Chris'downhill "credentials" in favor of a pack of more widely known speedsters, I had to decide if I wanted A-1 or Ketchup with that foot.Check his site if you think YOU KNOW. What I found was(A) The guy was running a Landingham Aero helmet (looks pretty big, but it reduces his aeroprofile to God knows-how-small and probably
generates a considerable amount of downforce when he's tucked,)(B)a Kilometro-Lanciato-style skintight rubber speedsuit,(C) and quite a number of you know about the deck already,but I'll just say THIS about THAT..YA EVER SEE A LE MANS RACECAR WITH THE BODY OFF? When I was in Sweden this summer,Eurosport ran continuous coverage of LeMans(all 24 hours)there were quite a few shunts, and everytime the corbonfiber flew off, THERE WAS HIS BOARD(get the drift?)Low Cg is going to be key to victory in the next ten years,and this is by no means the end of this matter,as race design is a dynamic process;It's funny,I always thought it would be one of the big manus who would be first with this kind of thing,But,HEY!!(ALL HAIL SPACE GHOST!!)
WINSTON GRANT
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$500 Condom?
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On 9/10/2000 Blah
wrote in from
(209.245.nnn.nnn)
with holes in it? That's a pretty crappy condom.
Congrats Chris on the race, you are the man. What shoes are you going to use for racing now?
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Seattle Results
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On 9/10/2000
Casper Newbie
wrote in from
(168.191.nnn.nnn)
Seattle Downhill update:
Tom Mason and the whole Red Bull team are to be commended for putting on another fanatastic show and for giving the riders another chance to go down in style. Great matchups, close finishes, and a hairy run out at the bottom provided the spectators and cameras with some great non-stop action and some local Amateurs got to earn their way into the Two Man Pro event. Of course the accomodations and hospitality that Red Bull is famous for was once again in full swing. Riders, family and friends were treated like kings and queens, and this seems to bring about the utmost in professionalism and sportsmanship on raceday.
The Weather Gods have an interesting sense of humor. While rain threatened the entire event from start to finish, it only rained on one heat and it just happened to be during the Two Man round featuring none other than Biker himself. Yes, they both fell in the first turn. The racing was stopped for five minutes, and afterward it remained dry until the award ceremony. Although talk of rain tires and slide gloves persisted throughout the day, they all stayed in the bag. The Kryptos seemed to hold a little better in the turns at the top and the Exkates seemed to roll a little better in the faster straights at the bottom. It was anybody's ballgame.
Finishing 1st, 2nd, 3rd and 4th were;
Four man: van Bommel, Chaput, Lehr, Dansie
Two man: Lehr, Chaput, van Bommel, Hardwick
How close do you like your final standings? With van Bommel's Gold/Bronze, Chaput's Silver/Silver and Lehr's Bronze/Gold, the combined "King of the Hill" crown had to be decided by a tie breaker, the qualifier. Lehr's 6th place time 51.23 was a little behind Chaput's 4th place time of 50.50, but van Bommel's 1st place time was .32 seconds faster at 50.18 and was enough to earn him an extra $1,000, more hardware to join his two Gravity Games 2000 Golds, and some well deserved bragging rights in the pro circuit. The margin of victory over Chaput in both the Four Man Final and the Two Man Final was 3 inches and 5 inches respectively. If Hardwick had beaten van Bommel in the Two Man consolation round, Chaput would have been "King of the Hill". This is as close as close can get. $8,800 of the $10,000 purse went to van Bommel ($4,100), Chaput ($2,500) and Lehr ($2,200).
In the Red Bull tradition, an awesome video tape of the event will be passed out to riders, and TV coverage could include another appearance on USA Network's Core Culture show. Our hats are off to you guys again. It doesn't get any better than this.
Okay guys, enough is enough. Trying to write in the third person here in order to sound objective and mask my overwhelming excitement is not working. I am so damned stoked about the race right now I can't sleep. So many very cool things have come my way that the fracture in my big left toe (yes my push foot) and my sprained right wrist and my shredded speedsuit don't seem to bother me one bit. Not once was there an ass in my face as I crossed the finish line the entire day. I was first in every heat but the two finals and both of those times I had riders in my peripheral vision as we crossed the line, resulting in a photo finish. While airbraking in the fast narrow run out after a quarter final victory in the Two Man, a squat-dropper who couldn't hit the brakes fast enough plowed me from behind and sent me tumbling 5 times. After discovering that I wasn't seriously injured (or so I thought), I learned that I would have to beat van Bommel in the semis to advance. My attempt to pass him in the Four Man left me inches short across the line, but he never pulled more than 15 feet in front of me through the turns, and made for an easy pass at the 3/4 mark. Lehr and I met in the finals and when the gates opened, neither of us budged for a second until I blinked first and used my big toe for the last run of the day. I tried holding him off with a few sweeping turns down the straights, but he yelled out "on your left" so loudly that I gave him more room than I probably should have and he nipped me by 5 inches or less at the line. My "King of the Hill" dreams were flushed, but standing on the podium with these two gracious winners twice, in my first pro race, gave me a strange sensation of being at home and yet at the same time, I kept telling myself, "Toto, I don't think we're in Kansas anymore".
I still have a lot to learn in racing, but I am happy to report that my drop-through "Roughcut" speedboards have exceeded my expectations. My Randals were as stable as ever and never wobbled. My Exkate Cherry Bomb/Mini Miser setup had all the speed I needed and justy enough traction to keep me out of the hay bales. My Landingham helmet continued its aerodynamic dominance. My kevlar leathers took a huge hit, protected me well, and didn't tear. My speedsuit worked extremely well but is now a $500 condom with holes in it. My Payless slip-on tennis shoes worked well until I fell and offered no protection resulting in a broken toe. I no longer recomend their use in racing. Some kind of wristguard is in order here too.
It's now 4:04am and my flight back to SoCal leaves in a couple hours now. I'll close by saying thanks for letting me bend your ear, and look for my Roughcuts to start hitting the market soon. I just had the time of life on one. It's all good.
Chris Chaput
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grooved wheels
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On 9/9/2000
Ryan Morris
wrote in from
(165.236.nnn.nnn)
Grooved wheels were more of a vert novelty than actually helping much for speed, just look at the old Bullet coffin cut 60mm 97a as an example. Jay Plummer's Z-grooves were toys for nice pools/ditches...and rain riding tends to do interesting things to your bearings and deck. The grooves keep you from hydroplaning, but if your deck is chipped, it tends to warp even after one session. Grooved guys might have less actual traction width, and more speed, but I don't know if it makes that much of a difference- and why not just buy normal wheels for a hell of a lot cheaper, because grooved wheels are collector's items as far as most people care.
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Drop-Thru Dregs
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On 9/9/2000 P.S.R.
wrote in from
(209.198.nnn.nnn)
David,Dregs are sturdy boards,so if you poke thru to install some Randles,it should be just fine,strength-wise.As an added bonus,it might even make that board ride good too.
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drop-thru
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On 9/9/2000
david
wrote in from
(209.179.nnn.nnn)
would a drop through truck work with a concaved board like the dreggs race board that I have. I know i would have to modify it to put wheel cutouts in but could the board still support the weight of me with all that wood cut out?
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drop thru templets
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On 9/9/2000
hugh r
wrote in from
(205.216.nnn.nnn)
First to Chris,
Of course there is room for both of us on this big ol' web... I just like to tease you dude!
Currently I am cutting down a S9 pintail into a speedboard... I will cronical its progress on my site.
Also, I have posted some templets for cutting the drop thru slots and for making the mounting plates. They will work for both the Randal Comp II's and the Downhills (base plate is the same size, just mfg'd different) The board templet is for use when NOT griding off the base plate tabs, but could easily be modified if you do choose to remove them... HR
I am using the dimensions for the wheel cutouts as suggested on the Chaput site (thanks Chris, great info)
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