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| Q&A: McKendry on Speed (1810 Posts)
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crails
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On 9/16/2005
panda
wrote in from
France
(82.225.nnn.nnn)
I julien.
I'm a truck freak and actually i do own a pair of crails.
My girlfriend is using them most often, i used them for downhill fun runs
on my sector 9 raceboard, she uses 'em for competition.
Basically for cheap trucks they're perfect, the best of both worlds between the randal DH and randal II.
They got 180mm hangers, 45 degrees angle, a really stable center position (which can handle lots of speed without wobbling).
I've heard some complaints about the bushings, if find 'em to be working great for DH.
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double wides
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On 9/15/2005 herbn
wrote in from
United States
(64.12.nnn.nnn)
very cool,i don't know if it would be faster, but if you made a sleeve to link the wheels and had pair of micro bearings in the sleeve OR a pair of 6008's as inside bearings with a 10mm o.d.sleeve as a spacer between the outer bearings. Either way you'd have to run non Biltin bearings (they would be hidden) the lower rotating weight might be worth it.
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randal substitutes
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On 9/15/2005
Julien
wrote in from
United States
(129.133.nnn.nnn)
Hey panda,
have you checked out the Crail downhill trucks?
They're from Brazil and can be a bit difficult to find but have a 45 deg angle and seem to be less inconsistent in their drillings than the randals
-julien
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fine by me
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On 9/12/2005
panda
wrote in from
France
(82.225.nnn.nnn)
fine by me.
the i-get-to-play-with-it-first attitude seems legit to me.
my insights having tried the jimz on both RI and magun baseplates as well as the complete maguns.
-- 45 degrees is a nice angle
-- Centered axles (aligned with the kingpin, like in geezerx's picture in the trucks forum on maguns) are great (kind of like slalom offset trucks, they stick to the road).
-- the spherical bearing might not be that good, it feels weird on the jimz's
-- not standard drilling pattern makes no sense (and is a big pain)
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Trucks, Kickflips
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On 9/10/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
I can't give any specifics about trucks, because I'm only doing one-offs and testing at the moment. What I can say is, that I have a laundry list of very specific features that I want in a truck, and if I can't get what I want, I don't want to play. Kind of childish, isn't it? Some of you know how I operate. I make something new, I'm the only kid who gets to play with it at the next race, and then I open up the floodgates and share with everyone.
Bob, I did kind of a kick flip in Montreal - on my streetluge. I was doing about 55mph in the straights and went to hit the brakes before a left hander. My brakes (the rubber I had glued too recently onto the bottom of my shoes) slid off and got sucked into my double-front, double-wide wheels, causing me to cartwheel down the track. It was quite a sight for riders behind me that included winner David Dean and runner up Yvon Labarthe. Whenever the sole of your shoe causes your board to flip, isn't that a kickflip?
Danny, hopefully we'll have you out of dorkdom and into kingdom soon. In the mean time, it's time to heal shoulders and backs, eh?
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Trucks
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On 9/10/2005 Danny Connor
wrote in from
United States
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
Chris,
So I guess that means you're gonna give me trucks too? Ha Ha I hope Randal doesn't get pissed if I give em a try! I'm on a total downhill dork fest right now. Montreal was too much. DC
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double wides
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On 9/9/2005
Bob
wrote in from
United States
(198.77.nnn.nnn)
Chris, those double wides look like they'd be good for doing ollie kickflips. How 'bout some video of you throwing down a kickflip or two. tee-hee.
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panda
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On 9/9/2005 panda@epita.fr
wrote in from
France
(82.225.nnn.nnn)
I kind of asked the same thing in the trucks forum,
but can you give us more hints (making us drool on 3d representations would be a good start) on what you're planning on for the liquid trucks (baseplate angle, axle width, hanger width...)
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What Next?
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On 9/8/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
Danny, It was great to see you back out there again. I may be hosed for the World Slalom Championships but I'm optimistic that my shoulder may not be a reoccuring thing. So far, it's stayed in place. I'm getting footage of that and the crash that took me out in the right hander. Should be good video.
MG's right about the Strikers, in that they are made for smooth and predictable sliding at speed, there are a few different forms of sliding.
1. Sliding through turns at speed, and
2. Sliding as an artform in itself, and
3. Sliding as a tool in carving hills
Unfortunately, there really isn't one wheel size/shape/hub/duro that can do it all. Sliding in racing will require taller wheels in softer compounds. Sliding as an artform requires smaller wheels in a harder compound. Sliding as a carve-tool requires something in between.
Sideset wheels slide more but cone more. Centerset wheels grip more, but cone less. Many sliders like flush mounted trucks, and can't use too big of a wheel. Many of my wheels top out at 88a, when 92a, 94a, or 96a may be a better choice for sliding. For now, some of my favorites include:
All Flywheels and 77mm Strikers in 81a (or softer) for speed sliding
62mm Pink Polka Dots in the hard compound (are you "man" enough?)
65mm Retro VertZ in 96a
70mm Flashbacks in 92a with the edges rounded
66mm Strikers in 88a with the inner edge rounded
65mm NO Skools in 94a
As time goes by, I'll have a better idea of what most people are looking for, and see if I can make a nice offering without breaking the bank.
Big Green Cushion WILL be made, but you're going to want a strong, straight truck with an intelligent cushion seat to best utilize them. Hmmm...
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You know you want me on green somehow....
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On 9/8/2005 Danny Connor
wrote in from
United States
(152.163.nnn.nnn)
Hello Chris,
Eventhough getting lost with you and Jimmy was fun, I'd have to say I had a blast at Top Challenge. Thanks for always making us guess what you're going to do next. Hope the shoulder is ok, I pop mine out on a regular and it's no joke. You were basically head-to-toe on the hay for a few. Anyway....those bushing sound really cool. Stock Randals are a bit "floppy" for me. Do you have any details yet? When they come out? Price? Duros? I'd like to give em a go. Get better...DC
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Slide Wheel
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On 9/8/2005
MG
wrote in from
United States
(216.52.nnn.nnn)
I thought the Strikers were a purpose built slide wheel, downhill speed sliding anyway. The 77s are sweet.
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Giving away the store?
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On 9/7/2005 EBasil
wrote in from
United States
(63.206.nnn.nnn)
You've "open sourced" the construction of a new wheel design, and now you tell your competitors how to make the truck setups? Dude! It's like you're in this to make us faster or something.
While you're at it, can you tell me how much green jello to use for those big cushions you have there?
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Slide Wheels
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On 9/7/2005
K-Rimes
wrote in from
Canada
(24.87.nnn.nnn)
Have you ever considered making a purpose built slide wheel?
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Helpful Hints
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On 9/7/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
Here are some tips and tools. From top to bottom:
Hammer
Punch
5/16" long drill bit
.3135" reamer
Big Green Cushions
6.25" Downhill hanger with 11.3125" Luge axle
Downhill axle
Luge axle alone (bent)
1/2" Chromoly axle stepped down to .314"
Hammer the end of axle closest to the "R" in Randal on the Downhill hanger (the knurling comes out easier). I do this with a disposable locknut on the end, so as not to ruin the threads.
Use the punch to keep hammering it out of the hanger.
Drill out the hanger with a long 5/16" (.3125") drill bit and ream it from both sides if necessary. The Luge axles have a .313" OD so I got a .3135" reamer.
Tap the Luge axle in place. Voila! I don't bother pin the axle in place because with 4 Biltin Bearings tightened by a locknut on each side, there's no place for it to go. The ends of the Luge axles are slotted for a screwdriver, in case the axles spin inside the hanger.
In the future I will take my axle concept (the bottom one) and extend the axle another 1" on each side.
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DBL WIDE
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On 9/7/2005
sean
wrote in from
United States
(63.105.nnn.nnn)
Chris, am I understanding this- The hanger is a randal 160mm and you smack the axle out and replace it with the 205 mm luge axle? I clearly understand everything you did except that. I am ready to make a set and try them out.
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Strong and Straight
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On 9/7/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
David, I didn't have problems with bending axles, and the next generation of axles that I use will be even stronger. Here's why:
The middle of the axle is 1/2" chromoly, and there is a filleted shoulder which steps the ends down to about .314". The four inner races of the Biltin Bearings are really precise steel tubes with an 8mm bore and a 12mm OD. There is a really nice slip fit and when the locknuts are tightened down, the whole system is like a solid 12mm to 12.7mm steel rod. Not only that, but the wheels and trucks want to stay nice and flat on the ground because each wheel is so wide that it doesn't deform as much as a more flexible lipped wheel would. The outside edges are also wide set, so the system as a whole is less likely to tip up on two wheels.
The result is that there is a not only a wider contact patch, but that it wants to stay flatter on the ground than with narrower wheels/setups, and/or more flexible wheels that deform in a turn.
My guess is that someone trying to do what I'm doing with regular bearings is more likely to bend axles because they can't tighten the locknuts and there are just a bunch of non-precision parts (washers, races, spacers) rattling around on the axle. Being able to compress the system adds considerable strength. I'm not trying to pat myself on the back, but Biltin Bearings solve so many problems that I doubt that I would have bothered to try this with regular bearings, washers, spacers, axles, etc.
In addition to the Downhill board, I ran a 6 wheeled streetluge with Doublewides and had no problems there either.
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axles
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On 9/7/2005 david
wrote in from
United States
(68.164.nnn.nnn)
chris you did'nt have any problems bending axles. i'd imagine having 2" of exsposed axles and that huge wheel would bend axles pretty easy? or were you using the same 1/2" Ti that you had at maryhill?
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Axles Anyone?
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On 9/6/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
BTW, You're not going to be able to do anything with these wheels unless and until you get some axles that are extended at least an extra inch of each side (2" overall).
I think that it's time to get Geezer-X involved on a joint mission...
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Making DoubleWides
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On 9/6/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
I'm getting a nice little lathe that will make "mass producing" wheels like this a simple task. I'm going to suggest a few things however.
1. Try them without the glue. I only glued them to comply with the "4 wheels per board" rule at Top Challenge. This means that you won't have to semi-permanantly trap your bearings inside.
2. Try them without the grooves. This can always be done later, like in the rainy season.
3. Try the same concept with 76mm, 90mm, and 97mm Flywheels, Gumballs, Grippins, Flashbacks, NO SkoolZ, and Strikers of various duros.
4. Try making them a little narrow on the inside, so that a small gap between the two wheels will allow the wheels to spin independently of one another. This makes more sense for Slalom wheels, or when you need to make tight radius turns, so that the inside and outside edges won't fight over the different arc lengths they are forced to travel.
The basic "kit", if you will, would consist of eight 3/4 cut wheels, and sixteen Biltin Bearings per board. Don't forget to get yourself some big green cushions (coming soon). The greener the better, if you know what I mean.
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Beautiful wheels
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On 9/6/2005
Patrick
wrote in from
United States
(68.85.nnn.nnn)
Chris, your wheels seem pratical. Any chance you can part with a pair? Do you think double-wides would work with Grippins or any other wheels?
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DoubleWides
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On 9/5/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
It takes a lot of green to make a lot of green...
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DoubleWides
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On 9/5/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
Cut the Flywheels to perfectly match the "washer" face of the Biltin Bearings (each 3/4 wheel becomes approximately 39mm wide). You will seal the fate of the 2 innermost bearings when you glue them up. I did 4 wheels at a time using a couple of 9" x 9" boards and threaded 5/16" bolts. If you mate two wheels together where either (or both) halves were cut a bit too narrow, the bearings in the middle will be pinched and never roll right. If the wheels are cut too wide, you can't tighten the locknut all the way or the outermost bearings will pinch the system.
They roll as fast as "normal" wheels, the traction is awesome, and they handle beautifully. The track width is cross between having 6" hangers on the inside, and 8" hangers on the outside.
The wheels are exactly twice as much money to make, not including all of the time and/or mistakes. They require twice as many bearings. They become 78mm wide, which is 50% wider than stock. The trucks require banging a stock Downhill axle out, and slipping a Luge axle in. The wheels are super heavy. They want to keep rolling fast (the flywheel effect). They last a long time. They don't cone. They are definite show-stoppers. Everyone does a double-take on the double-wides!
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proto flywheels
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On 9/5/2005
david
wrote in from
United States
(68.164.nnn.nnn)
so chris, whats the low-down on those crazy wheels you rode at TOP? do you think the extra mass made for a wheel with more roll speed or was it to much weight to control? how did they handle the corners?
sounds like you took a beatings, heal those old bones up and i look forward to seeing you again on a starting line... somewhere, sometime...
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Juicy Flywheels
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On 9/5/2005
K-Rimes
wrote in from
Canada
(24.87.nnn.nnn)
How'd you glue them up? I think My 83 could do with some chopping.
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Grippins
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On 9/1/2005
Chris Chaput
wrote in from
United States
(66.116.nnn.nnn)
Grippins will help quite a bit over Flashbacks, and you can use a harder duro (for slalom) like 81a or 84a. The slower turning rear truck is also a good thing...
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